Diana Pastora Carson:
This episode is proudly sponsored by ABILITY Magazine, the leading magazine for health, disability, and human potential that strives to shatter myths and stereotypes that surround disabilities.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Welcome to the Beyond Awareness, disability Awareness That Matters podcast. I'm your host, Diana Pastora Carson. Here you'll find a safe space to learn and grow with leaders in education, disability studies, disability advocacy, and diversity, equity and inclusion conversations. Specifically, we look at how disability fits into diversity, equity, inclusion, access and belonging, and how to frame disability awareness in the context of educating K through 12 communities. This show serves educators, parents, and community members who strive to learn and or teach about disability in a research-based and respectful way, moving beyond simple awareness and diving into inclusive and socially responsive conversations. Now, let's go beyond awareness.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Hello and welcome back to Beyond Awareness, disability Awareness That Matters. I am Diana Pastora Carson, your podcast host, and today I'm really excited to have with us Andrew Goff, who is the author of the book. Love Is A Classroom. And I'm gonna have you, Andrew, welcome to the podcast, first of all. And then I'd like for you to share who you are, your work and your book.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Absolutely. Thank you, Diana, so much for having me on your podcast. It is such a pleasure and such an honor to be with you. My name is Andrew Goff. I currently am the coordinator of Colorado Northwestern Community College's ECE program. But prior to that what,
Diana Pastora Carson:
What program? Could you repeat that? What is it?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
The Early Childhood Program at Colorado, Northwestern Community College, the, the instructor and and coordinator there. And prior to that and some other community college work, I had spent 12 years working with children who have disabilities in five different least restrictive environments. So it started out in a therapeutic preschool program, which was the most re well, not the most restrictive, but right up there at the top of very restrictive environments. At which point I discovered what early childhood was, because my bachelor's was in child psychology, and I was very just fascinated by child growth and development, and especially the psychology aspect of it. I never thought about early childhood education. I had thought about child psychology. And so I was given this opportunity to do a long-term sub position. And during that long-term supposition, just because you really can't do much with a bachelor's in child psychology, I was able to work at this therapeutic preschool.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
And I discovered what early childhood is, and almost fortunately, but unfortunately what high quality early childhood education is because it was a collaborative team effort. The children had, their families were involved because these children had been they were going through the Child Protective Service. They were going through Child Protective Services. And so they were in this program because they were at risk quote unquote. And the therapies were holistic. And so I saw the family workers, I saw the parenting groups, I saw the occupational therapy, physical therapy, everything was all happening right there in that program. And I said, I want to be part of this. This is amazing early childhood education. And then I went and worked in a childcare program. 'cause That was a long-term substitute position childcare. It was like most childcares. There were children who had challenging behaviors.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
There were children who, in retrospect, probably could have been receiving special education or early intervention services would've benefited from that. And so I discovered at that point in time that, wait a minute, not all early childhood care and education is what I experienced during that summer program. And went on to get my master's degree. In early childhood ed and early childhood special ed taught that in the public schools for nine years. The seventh year is what love is a classroom is about, is, and that lesson from that seventh year really it made me or encouraged me to take on other roles in the field. And so I started to think about where are we going wrong in the system? It was no longer about really the classroom. I saw the importance of the classroom all along from my early days at that nonprofit.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
But that year seven, where the book Love is a Classroom Takes place, taught me that it's much more to make the classroom function, you need the leadership in the classroom. However, it is a whole system working that truly is going to bridge this benefit of inclusion being beneficial to children with disabilities and without disabilities. And so that's when I moved on and pursued my, I had an opportunity to pursue my doctorate in early childhood special education at the University of Colorado, Denver. And got my doctorate. And here I am writing books, teaching students, and just contemplating and processing the world we live in.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Wow. What a journey. And my apologies for not referring to you as Dr. Andrew Goff. So I'm so, so glad that you did get the education and the experiences that you did, and that you've written this wonderful book that speaks to so many educators and families. And by the way, I enjoyed reading it or listening to it in audio book form, so our listeners know.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yes, the book is available. I I narrated it myself, as you know. I think there are at least four female voices in there. And as you can probably gather, my voice is not very accommodating to your traditional or the way that I heard those voices as I was experiencing them in real life. So it was a journey too.
Diana Pastora Carson:
You did a great job with the soprano voices .
Dr. Andrew Goff:
It's a journey. It was a journey. So it's available on audiobook ebook and paperback.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Awesome. Awesome. I appreciate that you created that accessible format for people. So Andrew, what is your, why? Why did, why inclusionary practices, why inclusive classrooms?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah. And I think I've thought about this a lot and I believe it's a, there's no real one turning point. It's a confluence of experiences from my earliest years growing up. I think in schools that were desegregated to later experiences. I was diagnosed with epilepsy when I was 15 parents, went through a divorce. Like all these variety of events really led me up to this evolving understanding of inclusion. And I think we hear about this from most people. It's like, you don't enter this field with the understanding of inclusion the way that you understand it today. Like, it's, it's a continuous growth process. And I think I've been growing this really since my earliest years of education. But when we think about, when I think about my understanding of inclusion as it is today I have to bring it back to, it was my it was my fifth year teaching and I was in it's when I was teaching in Tucson and my classroom got changed from a, what was an inclusive classroom to a self-contained classroom.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
So all the children were, they had IEPs. And when my class got changed, I said to my teaching assistants who had been with me the whole time, said, I don't wanna do this. I, I do not, I do not want to teach in a class where we don't have peer models. And my teaching assistant came over to me and she's, you know, we had been together for, you know, many years. And so she gave me a hug and she said, Andrew, every child needs a good teacher. And it doesn't matter where you're teaching, you're a good teacher and they need you. And I said, alright. So that kept me fueled for two years. But that whole time I kept thinking how much children were losing those children with IEPs, losing the opportunity to be able to learn from children without IEPs. And I didn't understand it at that point in time, but as I reveal, or I discuss in love as a classroom, it was that moment.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
And I wrote the book because it was that moment that I realized, wait, inclusion isn't just what's best for children with disabilities, which is what I saw. Children is really good for children without disabilities. So there's that, that point I think between my final two years in, in Tucson, my year in Denver where I developed this understanding that we can't really, we can't live in an inclusive society. We can't live in a society where every individual is provided with access, high access to the opportunities, their rights being met, feeling like they belong if we don't start early. Yeah. And, and so those turning points, and I hope that that's something that people gather when reading the book, is that it is something that has to happen early. It has to start from the very beginning of education. And it's not just about children with disabilities if done right, it's what's perfect for children with disabilities and children without disabilities when done right.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. And you, you were very clear about that in the book and several parts. One in particular, as you advocated for Giovan, one of the central characters one of your beloved students, you shared that his presence in the classroom, you shared this with administrators that his presence in your classroom helped to teach compassion and leadership to the class in ways that could not be taught without him. How, and you, you know, it's basically reiterating what you just said, but how did you come to that conclusion? Were there any examples that you wanna share or even one example of how you come to that conclusion?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah, I think that that was really I, when I was writing the book, I did a lot of reflecting on that experience, reading my journals, reading documentation, things that I hadn't looked at for many, many years. And there's a kiddo in the book someone who was in my class and his name was Eric. And he was a child who had very challenging behaviors for me. Like he was the kiddo who it was, we looked at all, you know, I had the research that I gathered while I was going through school, and it really didn't provide me much guidance on this. It was online research, trial and error over and over, what can we do to help this child? Because I always knew going, you know, especially into that year, that if we just have the right supports, children can succeed. But we just have to figure out the right supports.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
So we tried the weighted vest, we tried the seeding, we tried, I mean, it was, it was everything out there that really, there isn't necessarily evidence to support all of it, but it was like, we gotta figure this out. So we have Eric and he had challenged us, and there were several other children in that class that were, that had challenging behaviors or, or, you know, English language learners. But when Giovan when he, when Giovan joined that class, I saw Eric, who was a child who, whose interest, he, everything was driven by superheroes. And I was like, that's not new. You know, kids always had superheroes that that was not, you know, especially at that point in time. But he was really big into superheroes and I didn't know how to leverage that. But when Giovan came in, I just stepped back.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
'Cause All my attention at that point in time was going to Giovan. We had to support him. That's when before things, you know, a variety of things came into play. But I was supporting Giovan. And so by letting go I saw Eric step forward and help Giovan and these ideas that, you know, at the time I started to piece them together that these are skills that he was learning through these superheroes. Like, okay, these are, you know, superheroes depending on how you're, you know, pitching the story. They have compassion, they're leaders and those messages along with others that may not be as positive are continuously being communicated in superhero movies. And so he took that and he really, as I shared in the story, he really started to take the lead in the classroom with Giovan. And there are a couple other examples in the book.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
I wanted to keep it relatively brief. So there are other examples throughout that year. But he was the one that was just, it was just amazing to see how he took the lead to support Giovan. And there's a video obviously I can't have videos in the book, but there's a video that his mom took and I talk about it in the, in the book, but it was the very, it was the last week of school. It was, it was, I think Java's last day in class, maybe two weeks before. And she got a video, I wasn't able to catch it, but she got a video of Eric reading a story to Giovan. And Eric in the video's, like, he's my friend. He's my friend. And then he keeps like reading and, and Eric had a, a significant speech delay. So it was kind of hard to understand in the video, but it just exemplified how Giovan's inclusion in this class, you know, Eric wasn't somebody who did not have an IEP, he had an IEP also. But it taught him, it allowed him, it allowed us, it allowed even more importantly, his classmates to see him as a leader, to see him as compassionate. Whereas before Giovan was in there, it was, that wasn't necessarily clear. I don't know what kind of images the children had of Eric. They probably had this understanding that he's not a great kid to play with 'cause he doesn't listen to the teachers or he doesn't listen to other children. So that, that was one...
Diana Pastora Carson:
What is he contributing? Right?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Right, right. And, and it flipped the script. Yeah. And I, I provide a couple other just examples in the book, some of the stories. And I got these just from the pictures that I had taken and the videos and some other reflections that I had done throughout the time, looking at how, what happens when I turned the power over to the children, really, or at least allowed them to co-create the classroom and what we are doing. It provided them the opportunity to be themselves and really bring out their superhero skills or whatever skills they were acquiring from outside the classroom was then able to be brought inside the classroom. Whereas when I didn't have it set up that way, it was kind of like, check all that stuff at the door. 'cause You're coming in here. These are my rules, this is my curriculum, and that doesn't work.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. Thank you. Okay. So in the book, you really focus on your role as an inclusive educator, as not only being there for the students, but also being there for the families, which now is explained by your experience in, you know, early childhood or psychology c child psychology and early childhood education. Right. some examples that were so amazing to me is you learn Spanish to be better, to engage with your families. You bent the rules to be more inclusive of families, and you practiced cultural humility throughout you challenged district policies when they were in conflict with what you saw as the best interest of the student and the family. So my question is, was that part of your teacher training? Or what do you attribute that to and was there a negative impact to you personally while standing in conflict with district policies?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah, .
Diana Pastora Carson:
Okay. He's rolling his eyes. taking a deep breath, a sigh and rolling his eyes.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah. No, this is not stuff that was taught to me. And now as a college instructor myself for the past nine years. It's not something that can be taught in college that it has to be really, it has to be, there has to be internal motivation. There has to be a love and understanding of your children or of your students, the learners of the families. And you talk about cultural humility and that comes in again to what's my why? It, it's a confluence of experiences. One of them being that my wife is Mexican American and going through college at a predominantly white institution, the University of Minnesota in Minnesota, which has, you know, historically some more progressive policies, especially for inclusion. She often pointed out the systemic injustices. And, and at that point in time, I was just becoming aware of this.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
And so these are again just a variety of events that led me to understanding that, you know, I do not have all the answers. I will never have the answers, and I can only base my responses on as much as I've experienced in my own personal life. So, thinking about it from the higher education standpoint I'd really like students to have field experiences and analyze if they work in programs, their own programs, so that they can start to reflect on, well, here's where I stand right now. Just like I was, you know, required as I was going through desegregated schools or as I got when I got diagnosed by epilepsy and, and what that was like for schooling, my parents going through like all these events have helped me understand who I am in certain situations. And so that level of cultural humility at that point in time, I did, I had no concept of these terms.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
I wouldn't have ever thought of of it that way. It was recognizing, and honoring the dignity of every individual. And it just so happens that I discovered in that journey that that means I have to be able to communicate with families. And I don't expect, as I tell my students, they're like, I don't expect you to go out and learn another language, but what are the ways that are effective for you to communicate? And so that, and communicate in the classroom. So there's a lot, a lot of layers to that. But definitely it was not something that I learned in my teacher prep programs. And I don't think it's something that teacher prep programs can really, really teach. And, you know, if nothing else, I want this book, this story to allow learners, teachers going through teacher prep programs, teachers already in programs who have not experienced inclusion to hopefully read it or listen to it and get the actual visceral feeling of being in an inclusive classroom. Yeah. Because they may not ever have the opportunity up to that point. And then hopefully it inspires them to say, I want to have this experience. I wanna teach in an inclusive classroom.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. Thank you. I have to say, and maybe it's naive of me to think this, but I do believe that teacher preparation should be inclusive of stories. You know, like love is a classroom and that we can, to an extent teach teachers to be more culturally humble and to be more inclusive of families and, and to start embracing and honoring, like you said, recognizing and honoring the dignity of students of all abilities and their families. I think that we have to, we have to do better because we're placing people in classrooms without well hopefully we're doing, we are doing better than when you and I, well, I was a lot longer ago than you. But definitely, you know, I think that there is more emphasis on this, on these things in teacher prep. But I think we can always do better by ensuring that we have more voices of disabled individuals and families and multiply marginalized voices of people with disabilities as well.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah. And one of the things that I found you know, working at the community college, I have a lot of non-traditional learners, and I have a lot of students who have disabilities and some of them had IEPs growing up. And bringing that, creating a space where they can share that experience because often, and I, I've talked about this in the past in the recent past that we often focus on, and I have been very guilty of this myself, looking at the individual with the disability almost in isolation. Like we sit at IEP meetings and it's all focused on that child with that disability. What I've realized though is it's really important also to look at the whole system around that individual. Recently in my first series of my podcast, love is a classroom I was able to also interview and, and have on the show archer's sisters. And to hear the perspective of a sibling is something that doesn't really happen. And I think you can understand that. And to hear the siblings, his sisters talk about how, about him through their eyes. Like how do we spotlight siblings? How do we spotlight parents? How do we spotlight, take the spotlight off of, you know, me and elevate their voices? 'cause If we don't have that, if people don't hear that, then it's really, I think it takes away the humanity in the whole idea of inclusion.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. And also making sure that we're empowering communication of the individual and not just listening to the siblings. I mean, I am a sibling, right. But, you know, we wanna, we wanna empower communication so that people can speak for themselves as much as possible. And, and also honor family voices who are, obviously keeping the best interests and what they know their loved one is communicating with them through whatever means possible, whether it be through body language in multimodal ways, you know, whether it be through typing or certain key phrases that they say or through oral communication, but always keeping the voices of people who experience, who live that disability experience in the forefront for sure.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Right. And I actually kind of went on a, I got off topic and I was talking about the students who I, who, you know, have the disabilities and putting them forward. One of the interesting thing is they've made it to college.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
And so there's one thing about being in college and struggling and, and, but just being there is something to celebrate. But what's been interesting is they're given this opportunity to speak. And some of them who've gone through the education system with IEPs have talked about to a certain extent how they were never given that voice. Mm. And they feel like that disadvantaged them. And so it's brought up the question in our classes of when is it time to give the child that voice in the decision making process? Because there's a, speaking as a parent, it's scary to see my kids grow up. And I can't, I can't speak about it from, you know, anybody else's perspective. But at what point in time, and I'm experiencing this like right now, at what point in time do I hand the reins over and say, okay, it's your turn. You make the decisions. I trust you with your life choices. And then, or is it, I'm gonna make these choices for you. And so going back to, you know what you were just saying, giving people with disabilities the voice. Absolutely. And when, how, how early can we get that? And developmentally, when we talk about the IEPs and the placements and the future trajectory of the child, how are we giving them a voice in the decision making progress for their process, for their own education?
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. That's a great question, . That's a great question. Yeah. I'd be curious to be, I'd love to be a fly on the wall and hear what your students have to say about that. Okay. Let's move on to the next one. Kind of back to this concept of being torn between the expectations of being a district employee and and between your beliefs and duties as a fellow parent and fellow human being. Those, when you spoke of that in the book, it really resonated with me. And I wanted to ask why you think it's so difficult to be a heart-centered, inclusionary minded educator within our modern education system? What, what would need to happen or what would need to change to empower more inclusionary environments and systems in our school?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah. I don't know if you're familiar with the work at Inclusive Schooling Julie Causton and Kristie Pretti Frontczak. But Kristie she's talked over time before she was at Inclusive Schooling, she's talked about. And, but now more so than ever, she puts together the heart set, the mindset, and the skillset. And it's really, I think it's based off of Parker Palmer's work, who I'm a big fan of. But Parker Palmer talks about these ideas and courage to teach. And so the idea going to your question is, it starts out with the heartset. Like we have to have the heart set, meaning we have to love, we have to see our children, our students, our learners, our families as, as one of us, as we are all in the context of the same society. As much as we want to isolate or compartmentalize, we have to recognize that we're all part of the same community in the classroom and in the broader society.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
I think that's a, that's a big challenge. The reason that we have so many, I think, challenges in how to move forward. The first, the biggest challenge is, and I share this in the book, and I think this just comes out of those reflections. And this could always change. 'cause I'm all, like I said, things are always changing. Perhaps this is a change moment for me right now in this podcast. But it is, everything was so grounded in policy and it's by the books. And that's a, that's a good thing ish. Ubecause, you know, IDEA has really helped advance the field and the profession, and it's also stifled. And so it's kind of like, how do we use IDEA and to our advantage? And that comes into, okay, well we've got IDEA as, as the backbone.
Diana Pastora Carson:
And for our listeners who are wondering what that means, that's the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act. IDEA.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yes, IDEA Individuals Disabilities Education Act. How do we really take how do we take ownership? And I, I think that also in the book, Chris, the principal at, at Vista Elementary, she really had that heartset. And she created a school that empowered teachers. And I've been in schools where the administrators did not empower teachers to be leaders. So I really think that what it comes down to is, is it starts out with teachers feeling empowered and teachers feeling of being allowed to use that heartset and lean into that heartset. And something that's, that's interesting back to Parker Palmer that he talks about is he has this distinction between leadership in communities and leadership in institutions. And he talks about and encourage to teach. We have, when you talk about institutions, you don't really need leadership because institutions will go on with policies and procedures, and they'll keep going.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
But when you have communities, you need to have leadership. And so when we look at a district, I see it as that institution. Like, it doesn't matter who the superintendent is, essentially. They're gonna come in, they're gonna come out, and the leadership truly falls into the school. And the school is going to, and especially in Colorado where it's very school centered, like there isn't a lot of central power when the school has that opportunity really to interpret how we're going to do this in our school then it can be driven from the leadership and seen as a community where, when Chris left that school a year and a half later, or actually a half the following year things really changed. Like, when you have good leadership in a community, things are really going to change. So it goes into what are we doing for the heartset, the mindset, and then we can start talking about the skillset and how we're going to do this with IDEA in a classroom.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. Thank you. I love that. I've never heard that distinction. I always say heart, heart-centered but I've never heard that distinction that Julie Causton and Parker Palmer point out in, in, in, in their work. So thank you for sharing that. I will put links to their work in the show notes as well. So you, in all of that heart centeredness and your passionate work, you were 200% in at all times, from what I could tell in the book, so much so that it hurt. I mean, it was painful to read. I've been there. I could totally sense and empathize with all of the, you know, the being torn between your family time and, and the work that you had to do and the research you wanted to do, and how you wanted to make it better for each and every one of those students. And the, the classroom preparation that you had to do,you know, your work brought you home late to your family and kept you working even when you were at home, and it kept you awake at night sometimes. How did you find balance and peace of mind? Or did you, you know, and what have you learned or gained from your experiences in that role?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah, when it, in the moment, you know, everything is hindsight. And so I look back and I didn't see that year as any more of a standout than any other year until I started to reflect on it. So it wasn't like what I did during 2012-2013 school year was different than the way I approached teaching the previous years and the following years. And so when I go back and I looked at it and I reflect on it just as a teacher in general, and even to this day, it's, I didn't have the words for these, but now looking Eckhart Tolle has a book that you may be familiar with the Power of Now. And I just, I just read this recently, and it, a lot of times I read books and it just validates what I already felt. And that's really what it is for me to maintain balance.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
It's being in the present. And I often, and I, again, I've done this throughout my career, I need to dump, I like, I need to dump my ideas. And so I always write, and I, it's funny, when my initial draft of this book had a lot of, like, I'm like, I'm gonna do my journal, like, journal writings. That will be really interesting. People can read what I wrote in the journals, you know, when I was up late at night, two o'clock in the morning, three o'clock in the morning. And then my publisher was like, yeah, no, you're not gonna have that in there. That's just, no one's gonna wanna read your random thoughts. I'm like, okay, fair enough. I'm glad that was great advice. But yeah, but, you know, I've gotta get that off my, my plate. Let me just get these ideas down, write 'em down, and then what I would do, and what I do is I, you know, go into, after I'm done writing, getting it off my chest, I'll go in and hopefully I can do, you know, I just close my eyes, count my breaths with my heartbeat, get it all and see, you know, meditative practices.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Never knew what meditation was before, but that's what I've done. As I've also, you know, being present. So getting that off my chest and then being present as I'm trying to fall asleep. You know, in my day-to-day, it's about exercising, get out, getting out and walking, being present and enjoying what we have right now, and not thinking about the fantasy of the future or these recollections that are all imagined from the past. If I get caught up in those, I know it's just going to take me down deeper, darker holes. And so to stay balanced for me really is, is to really recognize one, there is stuff that I need to reconcile. There are things from the past that I need to cope with, and in any given moment, I need to be focusing on, on the present. And that's really important, especially when you're working in early childhood, when things just move so quickly. And so I think it's just a good skill set to have as an educator too, to be focused on the present.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Absolutely. Oh, you know, what comes to me about that right now is oftentimes it takes a jolt of an experience to bring us to the present. And I think in your story, you know, central to the story is Giovan, who's diagnosed with a life-threatening disease and fatal disease. And so when you talk about, you know, advocacy and being present and the power of now, it's like, now we need to do this now for this child, for this classroom community. And being able to I mean, it really puts things in perspective be, you know, there's a comparison I think, between the, before Giovan and after Giovan. And what a gift to you and your classroom community that he was, that his family was, that Chanel, his mother, was in that learning and growing about what is important right now. And I'm really glad that you found that n your personal life, a way to be in the now as well. And, you know, beginning a meditative practice, d just taking moments to breathe and to be be present with who you are and what this life's journey is about.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah. Really, really important. And thinking back that, that definitely was a turning point in my life, just recognizing how fragile life is. Yeah. And I've, I've lost family members to ALS and so it's, you know, a diagnosis can come at any moment in time. And we have to be to, we have to be grateful. And that can be hard in the day-to-day struggles of paying bills in the future, and the things that have me, you know, from the past that are creating barriers now.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Okay. Are you ready for some fun?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
I'm always ready for fun with you, Diana.
Diana Pastora Carson:
. Awesome. Great. Andrew. Okay. It's rapid fire time. So bonus questions, rain or snow?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Snow.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Beach or theme Park
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Beach.
Diana Pastora Carson:
You're very, he's very committed to that. Just for the audience to his eyes lit up with that.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Well, I have to tell you, I just dropped my daughter off at an amusement park, which I had to go to last week. And I am not a fan at the age of 43. Not a fan of amusement parks anymore. Just . Have fun. Sorry.
Diana Pastora Carson:
I certainly am not either. I get dizzy very easily, so not a good fit. Okay. Harry Potter or Chronicles of Narnia.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Chronicles of Narnia, then my whole family would be disappointed in me.
Diana Pastora Carson:
.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
I, I love, I love from the very beginning that idea of, of going into the closet and something that we see as so normal and accept as, as this is what life is, and then a magical world behind it that's always been there. And that, that, that concept has just kept me in awe since I was a young child when I first read the books. Maybe it's 'cause Harry Potter wasn't published until I was already in college.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. There's meaning there for sure. Your favorite TV series when you were a kid?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
I, I watched baseball. I didn't really like tv. I was a huge,
Diana Pastora Carson:
The World Series, the World Series
Dr. Andrew Goff:
. I'm a huge Cubs fan. It's baseball. There's 160.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Okay.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
So, so
Diana Pastora Carson:
That works. That works. Dancing or singing.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Singing
Diana Pastora Carson:
Coffee or tea.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Coffee is essential. Tea is enjoyable.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Okay. And something that becoming a parent has taught you about child development that textbooks did not teach you?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Wow. There's so much. You have, I have no control. Like, at the end of the day, I don't even think I had any influence. Like, at least, at least when I was going through school, I could have been told, you know, I don't have, you won't have control as a parent, I, I would've bought into that. But yeah, you really don't have influence either. And I will say I, this, I'm like at a pivotal point in, in parenting where I've got a 10 and a 13-year-old. So they're at this like, transition point and I keep questioning like, is anything I did the first eight years that like, was really beneficial and created these strong relationship? Was any of it worth it? . Like, it just seems like it's all just, it, it's all like not visible right now as they discover who they are as individuals. And so, yeah, the biggest lesson, broad lesson is, you know, it's all about being there to love your child. All you can do is love your child. 'cause The rest kind of unfolds on its own.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yeah. I think I interviewed Shelly Moore and she, Dr. Shelly Moore, and she also said, when I asked that question, she busted up laughing and basically said the same thing. I have no control. Yeah. So, but she has,
Dr. Andrew Goff:
If, if I know correctly, she's got a toddler.
Diana Pastora Carson:
She does. Yeah. So,
Dr. Andrew Goff:
So Shelly just wait until adolescence. . .
Diana Pastora Carson:
Yep. Okay. So Dr. Andrew Goff, what is next for you? And is there anything you wanna share that you're working on with our listeners? Where can people get your book? How can they reach you?
Dr. Andrew Goff:
Yeah, so what's really exciting for me is I am in the process of finishing up my second series for the podcast. Love is a Classroom Stories of Inclusion. The first series was with Archer who and his family and his teacher and the director of the program he was in. He has Cerebral palsy. Absolutely wonderful. And now the second series that I'm working on coming to completion is it's, I'm not gonna spoil anything. I'll, I'll publish a trailer, but it's gonna be a really great series. So go to any of your podcasting apps and look up Love is a Classroom or stories of inclusion and you'll find the podcast there. Follow, subscribe. The, if anybody wants to follow me beyond the podcast, they can find me on I do probably most of my posting on YouTube just through shorts. They can follow me on Instagram. Both are Love is a Classroom and then same with Facebook, but I do most of my activity on, on YouTube or on Instagram.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Awesome. I will include all of those links in the show notes. Dr. Andrew Goff, thank you so much for joining us.
Dr. Andrew Goff:
It's been a pleasure. Thank you so much, Diana.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Thank you for tuning into this episode of Beyond Awareness Disability Awareness That Matters. I love providing this podcast to support you in your passionate disability awareness and inclusionary practices work in our schools and communities. And I hope you'll help me to help others by promoting this episode far and wide. You can also proactively support this podcast in the following ways. Subscribe, rate, and review this show on Apple Podcast, Google Podcast, Spotify, or wherever you listen to this episode, it really means the world to me to have your support in this way because it increases the chances of others getting to hear the messages presented in each episode. For more valuable resources that align with the values of this podcast, you can visit my website, diana pastora carson.com, where you'll find links to my priceless free resource, how to talk about disability with kids, as well as my blog where I share my thoughts as an educator and sibling advocate, my flexible online Beyond Awareness Basics course, my books, including the beautifully Illustrated children's book, Ed Roberts: Champion of Disability Rights, as well as my comprehensive guide for anyone wanting to do disability awareness work.
Diana Pastora Carson:
That is the book entitled Beyond Awareness: Bringing Disability into Diversity Work in K-12 Schools and Communities. Now, while I love this book so much, and I believe you should have it in your library as a resource, I do understand that time is of the essence. So if you are super busy like me and you just need something quick, easy and convenient, that will get to the point I have just what you need, you should definitely get your hands on my handy trifold laminated Beyond Disability Awareness Educators Guide, published by NPR Inc. Again, all of these resources can be found at DianaPastoraCarson.com. You can also follow me, Diana, on Instagram at Diana Pastora Carson and at facebook.com/GoBeyondAwareness.
Diana Pastora Carson:
Podcast, transcription and podcast guest information can be found in the show notes. Intro and outro music has been provided courtesy of my son Emmanuel Castro. Thank you again. Be well, be a lifelong learner, and let's be inclusive. See you next time.
Latin Music:
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
